Blues Legend Sumlin Plays Woman's Club Saturday

Hubert Sumlin was Howlin' Wolf's guitarist for more than 20 years, starting in 1954 and continuing with Wolf's Gang after the singer's death in 1976. He's recorded and gigged with rock luminaries including Jimi Hendrix, Stevie Ray Vaughan and the Rolling Stones—all of whom name him among their greatest influences.

Rolling Stone magazine recently named Sumlin as the 65th greatest guitar player of all time—a recognition made even more impressive by the fact that most of the top 10 have covered his songs or counted him among their influences and friends.

In a recent bout with cancer, Sumlin had to have a lung removed. Still, when I got Sumlin on the phone, I was confronted with a larger-than-life voice, a boisterous personality and frequent, explosive bouts of laughter. Even when he is coughing, you can hear the blues man's irrepressible smile, and he's got more insight into life and music than even his 70-year love affair with both should rightly afford him.

Interview with Hubert Sumlin

Hubert Sumlin!  So nice to finally hear your voice.

You too, you too. Elias, right? Man I got this cold.

That's me.  How you feeling?

(coughing badly) I'm alright! Just doin' fine. I got that thing, you know, every year like this. Coughing and sneezing and the runny nose and... what they call that?

Damn.  Yeah, I read you had a lung removed...

Yessir.

...And you're 77 years old...

Mm hmm.

...And you quit smoking and drinking...

That's right.

...What keeps you going? And gigging? I've seen your set list and tour dates. I don't know young musicians with your fortitude.

Well I tell ya, Eli, I just love what I do. I been playing since I was six years old. Seventy... Seventy one years now. And It keeps me healthy.

Spoken like a true artist.  Same for me and writing.

You know it!  See, that's right. And you'll see, I'm not doing nothing tomorrow and Saturday I'll be playing and I'll be alright! Now I got this cold or whatever. What do they call that when you got this coughing and runny nose every year...?

Allergies?

That's right. But playing will make it better. Ever since I was just little.

Yeah, I read you got your first guitar when you were really small.

I got my first guitar when I was six, cost $8.

My brother AJ was my idol. Did you know that? My big brother. He put up bailing wire on the walls. For making hay bails, you follow? So strong, he said you couldn't break it. And he played it and I played it. And it made this crazy sound. But it come off the wall. Now he said I broke it, but I didn't, it just come unbound like where the nail was. Boy, he hit me, threw me. Up under that old house it was all cinderblocks, the place was built on cinderblocks, you understand? And it all come down on me.

Are you telling me a house fell on you?

No, see, the house was made on cinderblocks and it was all blocks up under where I run and hid. And blocks came down. I seen stars, I seen everything. And here comes my brother, taking the block off me and he run because he knew he was gonna get it when Mom come home.  He didn't come back for three days. I was begging my mom, please, please I want a guitar.  Eventually she got me one.

And my brother come back and my Mom beat him. And dad beat him good. But not so good he couldn't work—he was old enough to work, you see? And he went to work another two days but then he said he was sick because he wanted to see me play the guitar. He just sat there widemouthed. Kept asking me to let him play the guitar but after what he done to me, I didn't have to let him hold it or nothing. After two days though, he's my brother and I didn't want him to miss more work and I let him hold it and he played it real good. He was great. You know, he played it with his teeth! Didn't miss a note.

What kind of guitar was it?

Man it didn't have no name, nothing (laughter from both of us). I wouldn't lie to you! My brother was good, though. My hero, amazing, I think so. He passed, down on the plantation. People come from all over the world when his marker was put up. I was down there, too.

Why do you think your brother never went pro?

Oh, no one could get him to. Record producers, other musicians... I couldn't, and I'm his brother. I think it was because he raised kids. And rice. He had 20 kids. And he raised rice and soybeans all along the river on the plantation where we grew up.

You know Jimi Hendrix also got his first guitar as a little boy?

Oh, I knew Jimi every way. Him and his sister, Janie. We played with him and toured in London with his bass player and drummer. He was a good guy, really nice.

Did you know about his drug use?

Oh sure everybody knew, but what are you going to do? You know, he was alright, just a good guy. Great guitar player.

Speaking of Jimi, so many famous guitar players list you as one of their influences. What's that like?

I just feel like if I reach one person, help one kid, then that's great. You know? It feels good, feels alright. And I get to play with them.

You played with the Stones, right?

Oh yeah. Up on stage. And on a record. I got so many people to record with me. Keith Richards and the Stones and Eric Clapton and just so many different people. Even on my last record, About Them Shoes. It was an experience, man.

I heard a little bit on your Web site. I have got to get a copy.

Oh you can get that anywhere, over at Best Buy or Barnes and Noble or Borders.

What was it like playing with the Stones?

Those guys are alright. Good musicians, really good people. Fun to play with, too.

A lot of musicians have complained about gigging with the Stones, say it's like a shopping mall.  The Red Hot Chili Peppers...

You know, people say this and that and ... and you can say anything you want, but no they were really alright. And they helped me out and I got to show them a thing or two.

I understand you have an unreleased album recorded in 2000 with lots of other guest artists.

Yeah, on that next record. The Rolling Stones aren't on it but plenty other people are. And it's great playing with all of them. Clapton, and a lot of Wolf's old gang and everybody.

I read a story that you first met Howlin' Wolf by sneaking into one of his shows. Is that true?

Yeah, sure is. I was just around 10.

Is it true you fell onto the stage?

Well, I fell through the window. Onto the stage.

You must have made a hell of an impression since he asked you to play with him about 10 years later.

Oh yeah, I sure did. And he did! He was big, Wolf was just big. Muscle and bone, the shape of him. Size 15 and a half shoes. He was just like a baby, now. You know what I mean, like a baby? He would talk to anybody, real friendly, get to know you. But if you start talking that junk he just walk on. Wouldn't hit you, no trouble, just walk on.

What was it like playing with Wolf?

It was just great. I mean, he sent me home once. Fired me. I was upset, angry. But he never told me nothing wrong, so I knew I must have been doing something wrong. I was playing too fast for him or something. But we got on fine after that and I come back.

Wolf showed me a lot. Everyone knows he was a singer, but he could play the guitar. He could really play. And he showed me stuff that Charley Patton taught him and he'd say, "I'm showing you, but I'm wrong." And he'd say that because he never learned to play guitar properly, classically.

So how'd you get to play with Wolf after all that time?

Well, me and James Cotton grew up together, started our first band together. And Cotton ended up knowing Wolf. So Cotton got me to play with Wolf, then he wanted me to find him someone to play with! So I got to Wolf and Wolf got Cotton to play with Muddy Waters.

And everyone thought Muddy Waters and Wolf was enemies now, but that just wasn't true. They were great actors. They could get away with anything.

There was one time we were playing a blues festival and they put Muddy's trailer and Wolf's trailer right next to each other. And so someone decided they were going to put a hole in Muddy's trailer with a sledgehammer! Now how do I know it was a sledge hammer? They left the thing right there against the hole! You know how hoodlums are.

So come a day everyone's gonna go fishin' but Muddy and Wolf decide they were going to stay behind. And I decide I wanted to hang around, too. Otis Redding stayed back and asked me why I'm staying and I said, "I think I know something and I think you do, too." Well we stayed back and waited and come up to the trailer a little while on and looked in the hole and there was Muddy with a bottle in his hand and Wolf with a bottle of whiskey in his hand and they was all hugged up and crying and carrying on and Wolf saying "Oh man you know I love you and I wouldn't do nothing to you..." So we knew. And then those guys came riding on the bandstand together on a motorcycle.

What was it like moving to Chicago at 23 years old?

Oh it was a good time. Sure, I was scared, coming from Arkansas but it was good. I come up and I was going to start playing with him but he gave me two weeks off. Another band leader's guitar player was sick so I filled in for the two weeks I had off. I guess I showed them something because, man he didn't want to let me go, but Wolf had just lent me to him, see? You follow me? I thought I was going to have to fight him to get out and back to Wolf!

Did you like the city?

Here's what I liked: making lots of friends and going out. We had a real good time. What I didn't like was the living situation. My apartment was half on the El train, the train tracks right underneath me. That train came by every five or ten minutes. I hated that train. Couldn't take the noise. Lived there for years and I decided to move to Michigan. I was moving around when Wolf got real sick and passed.

Did you get into any trouble in the city?

No, no, only trouble I got into was for fireworks!

Fireworks?

Oh yeah, I wouldn't lie to you! (laughing) I was in the car with Wolf's other guitar player and Wolf had just come back from down south and he brought a bag of fireworks. He gave me half and the other guy half and we're in the car and he lit one and gave it to me. So what am I gonna do? I toss it out the window! The cops must have been right behind us because we get pulled over.

He's calling me Babyface Leroy, push me up on the car, spread my legs. I'm scared, I'm thinking he's going to hit me. He says, "You must be Babyface Leroy, huh?" I'm going (mock whimpering) "Please don't hit me! Don't hit me!"

Now, I had a gun in the car, a .25 I bought in Florida, and the other guy has a .22. Up under the seat cushion. And the cops search the car and come up with the guns.

They found the guns?

Oh yessir, yeah they sure did. And then I thought I really had it. We got locked up and they called Wolf and Wolf said he'd be there in a couple minutes. Wolf explained we were musicians and no trouble. We got to work that night. We paid a fine, but we got to work that night. The other fellow, the driver, had to stay.

You get caught with guns now, you don't get off with a fine!

You know that's right!  (laughing) But back then they just checked with Florida, you know how they do, and found the guns were bought and they hadn't been used to kill anybody and that was that.

Man, that's crazy. Are there a lot of other differences between playing music then like 20 or 30 years ago and now?

You know, there isn't. The cats coming up they look to us for inspiration and really it's a lot the same... you know about this rap?

What rap?

You know, that rap. Rap, man.

Oh, you mean rap music.

Yeah, what do you think of it?

I like some of it. Flo Rida and ...

Well, the beats changed but the spirit's the same. They use a lot of the same lyrics we sing they rap. You see what I'm saying? Big difference is now it's so we can make a whole lot more money! (laughing).

Yeah and the personalities are really similar, too.

You know that's right! Now you got it, sir!

Man you have got to call me Eli.

Oh, well thank you, Eli. That's right. And I hope I get to see you on Saturday. I got no memory for names but I remember a face!

Oh, I'll be there, and I want an autograph.

You got it, man! (laughing) You just come on back to the dressing room or wherever and say I'm Eli and I'll say, hey, maybe I know you.

That's great. You know I will. So you've played with Howlin' Wolf, Muddy Waters and released 15 solo albums...  Hell of a career discography. And you're still going...

Oh, thank you, yeah I got a lot of records. And I'm on a lot of records, too. I got to record with so many musicians, playing guitar for 70 years now. How am I going to stop? This is just what I do and I always have. I play the blues, you know what I mean?

Yeah I do, you've been playing for a lot longer than I've been alive!

(great big laugh) How old are you, Eli?

I'm 29.

Oh, I hear you, yeah, you've got a lot of knowledge though, man.  I can tell.

Hey thanks, man. 

No sweat, brother.

And you're touring all over the country...

All over the world, brother!

... you've quit drinking and smoking, what keeps you going?

Well I quit and I felt better. You know, had the lung out and I stopped [drinking and smoking] and I felt alright. Felt good. So I started again and man, I felt worse than anything. Felt so bad... damn. So now I just stopped, don't do nothing man. And now I feel great. And I can still play.  I keep going, because I know what I got, it's a blessing from God. I don't have nothing but what he give me, but he didn't give me nothing I didn't have. So I use that. And that's how I feel alright.

So what is music to you?

You know, Eli, I put it like this: it's just love. I mean that, if you come to my house, and I hope you do, you go in my basement and you'll see I got nothing but records. I got records I haven't even listened to, but I got them. Music is everything.

I can tell you're getting pressed for time, do you have any advice for young musicians? Anything about how to get ahead, how to deal with the music business?

(Very enthusiastically) Yes I do! Just get in with the right people. You know old Wolf couldn't read his name, couldn't write, couldn't do no math at all. Everything he did was sign an X. Everything. So you got to know who you're working with. It was in Chicago he finally went to school and learned to read and write and do numbers but until then, nothing. So just get in with the right people. And believe in yourself. You can be anything you think of, anything you want. I wish I knew that when I was younger, but I'm not complaining.  I'm still around. And the ones coming up now, they can look at us and be almost us. They can't be us, and they don't all have what I have, but they can almost be us and make it something new.

I'm not bragging, but you have to have heart. I give away more than I make. I went to Nigeria with the State Department, and I seen how they do over there. And I gave them two weeks pay. Now that's just a pee in the bush, but I do what I can.

Were you there when Muhammed Ali was?

Yeah, I was on that program. So many people. I been three times.

Would you have ever played a venue like the Woman's Club in the '50s or '60s?

Oh sure, yeah. Why not? I mean, I can't tell you I've been to the place before but I tell you this: things going to change. They'll be talking about this one!

I know they will.  I'm counting on you to get my girlfriend to dance.

(explosive laughter) It's done man, it's on. (knocking on the door, then aside:) Yeah, alright, OK. Eli, I got to let you go, love to stay on the phone but I'm talking to you in the bathroom and Toni's knocking on the door. I'm in this movie "Cadillac Records" and I wanna go see it. It's in segments and I'm in this one.

You're in the bathroom?  (laughing)

You know it, man (laughing). You want privacy, right?

It was really great talking with you, Mr. Sumlin.  I can't wait to meet you.

Same here, thanks, Eli. You take care now. Alright.

For tickets to the show, go to Brown Paper Tickets Web site.