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McKeon Debates Millionaire's Tax on Television

Watch your local lawmakers on News Channel 12 at 10 a.m. and 3 p.m.

 

 

Assemblyman John F. McKeon (D-27th Distirct), lead sponsor of the Millionaire's Tax, joins Senate Republican Leader Thomas H. Kean Jr., and News12's Luke Margolis to debate Gov. Christie's proposed 10 percent tax cut this morning at 10 a.m. and afternoon at 3 p.m.   

From McKeon's office:

McKeon blasted Christie's proposed reduction in income taxes as favoring the rich, with the majority of the estimated $1B in cuts going to millionaires and a minimal impact on the middle class. "Is that fair?" he asks. McKeon has called for shared sacrifice with the Millionaire's Tax which would impose a 1.7 percent surcharge on income above one million, generating an estimated $600 million, which would partly fund suburban schools and result in property tax rebates. He also criticized Christie's proposed Budget for taking away rebates granted in earlier budgets by Democratic governors. "People care more about property taxes..." he said.  

"While I believe the 16,000 millionaires in our state should be celebrated... if we took the estimated $600 million generated from the millionaire's tax and gave some of it to suburban districts, like in your district Tom, there would be real property tax rebates," McKeon (D-Essex\Morris) said in his discussion with Kean and Margolis.   Responding to a question from Margolis on whether an across-the-board tax cut would have a trickle down impact of stimulating the economy, McKeon said, "Trickle down is a myth," pointing to how 20 million more jobs had been generated with a higher tax rate during the Clinton Administration than during the Bush Administration, which cut income taxes.  

Join the conversation on Sunday, Feb. 26 at 10 a.m. and 3 p.m. on News12's New Jersey Power and Politics.

Related Topics: nj millionaire's tax

wohopeful

3:15 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

I guess John McKeon did not get the message when his own party members spanked him, that he is no longer of any relevance in Trenton. Oliver, Sweeney, et al. put McKeon aside in favor of cooperation.

Adam Kraemer

4:04 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

With deference to John McKeon and his good heart and good intentions he is wrong on this issue: If we raise income tax on millionaires they will move out of state. If you don't believe me:Go down to central New Jersey and look at the helicopters taking the multimillionaire pharmaceutical executives going to homes in three percent flat income tax Pennsylvania every day. In the end the tax policy of chasing the very wealthy out of state will reduce total gross tax receipts for the state. The answer is to make state and local government smaller and focused on the few things we truly need government for and thus reduce the need to tax people at all levels of income and make us all wealthier and better off as result.

Rev. Susan Gillespie

6:29 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

How will people at all levels of income be wealthier if they have to send their kids to private schools, hire private security guards, and pay for private fire brigades? Our problem Is reduced revenues...utilizing a recession to gut government isn't going to improve our communities. And the rich folks still won't stay put!

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Adam Kraemer

8:17 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

@ Susan: With deference to you position government does not generate wealth. Business and entrepreneurs generate wealth. Government can make it easier or more difficult for wealth generation to occur. Also, as New Jersey ranks either 49th or 50th of the fifty states in terms of total state and local tax burden per person and other states mange to have public schools, fire protection, and law enforcement with lower taxes. It is a question of running government within the confines of a reasonable cost structures. Thus, I would argue we in New Jersey and locally in West Orange have a government spending problem as opposed to an issue of not generating enough money for the government in tax revenue.

Paul P

7:31 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

His millionaire investor pals at GP 177 Main Urban Renewal, L.L.C. probably don't have the same opinion on this matter,

James Joseph

9:50 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

Adam Kraemer has no clue about economics. When does has his trickle down theory worked. IF millionaires want to leave let them. Locally in West Orange the problem is with the school taxes voted to approve the budget by the tax payers not the local government officials. I have seen him run in a few elections apparently voters have rejected his ideas and not elected to any local office. James Joseph

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Adam Kraemer

6:48 am on Monday, February 27, 2012

@ James Joseph: The problem with letting millionaires leave is that tax revenue goes with them.

Time4Dick2Go

10:14 pm on Sunday, February 26, 2012

Too bad Assm. McKeon statement, "if we took the estimated $600 million generated from the millionaire's tax and gave some of it to suburban districts," is just a hypothetical. In practice, any additional revenue raised through a Millionaires Tax would be funneled to the Abbots by the NJ Supreme Court, just they have been doing with the ever increasing Income Tax take by the state.

When McKeon passes a Constitutional amendment that guarantees equal funding for all school children from our Income Taxes, then he can come back and make promises about additional revenues going to suburban districts. In the meantime, it's just another BIG LIE.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

8:14 am on Monday, February 27, 2012

I would like to see our politicians stop promoting class warfare to further their own careers. If we need more revenue, fine. How about cutting spending to meet revenue? If the state must have more money in taxes, okay- Hit everyone. Don't just go after the people who have worked the hardest.

MP

9:47 am on Monday, February 27, 2012

McKeon raised our (average middle class families in West Orange) taxes 7 to 10% a year to pay his union supporters extravagent salaries and benefits. His mentor Dick Codey moved to Roseland probably because he couldn't take it any more! He has been double dipping on state jobs and pension. He is a crook and should be defeated.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

1:15 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

MP,

I don't know if he is a crook or not. The double dipping is pretty sleezy but McKeon will blame the School Board for the tax increases. If I could sell my house, I would. They keep raising the taxes and I might just walk away from it.

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Gary Englert

2:15 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

@ MP and Paul Corrigan from West Orange: First and foremost, assessing responsibility for municipal property tax increase on any one individual is so ridiculous as to be absurd.

Mr. McKeon served and managed the Township well during his 12 year tenure and brought in zero increase municipal budgets during 5 of those 12 years. Please do keep in mind that municipal government is only one small rung up the economic ladder from the citizen-taxpayer and both are subject to the same economic forces well beyond their control.

That said, Mr. McKeon did hold two elective offices (Mayor and Assemblyman) for a period of time, having been elected and re-elected to both repeatedly. The practice was not illegal nor "sleazy" and represented the majority of his constituent's will.

For MP to call the man a "crook" is nothing more than cowardly, anonymous character assassination...period.

Though his holding both offices was "grandfathered in" and he could have continued to do so, he opted not to run for re-election as mayor.

Whatever your personal feelings may be here, the simple fact of the matter reamins that Mr. McKeon serves in public office at considerable detriment to both his family and personal finances.

He'd be far better off financially if he devoted his time and energies solely to his law practice.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

4:29 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

The Beauty of this nation is that even a tax payer like me can express an opinion and vote. I will do both. I think there is an appearance of sleeze with the double dipping and with this land deal. If allowed to vote against it, I will. I don't like the left pushing the class warfare to get votes. I think that is sleezy. Just my opinion.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

4:30 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

And Gary, everyone who does not agree with you isn't a coward. Tone it down.

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Gary Englert

5:37 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

@ Paul Corrigan from West Orange:

Hiding behind a screen name and calling another human being "a crook" is an act of cowardly, anonymous character assassination and I need not "tone it down" or apologize for identifying it for what it is.

Disagree with someone's political positions and philosphy all you'd like but, do so with some logic and common sense rather than unbridled nonsense.

Paul P

4:45 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

The shady and unethical behavior of McKeon and some of his WO administration is well documented. I wouldn't say he is a "crook", maybe a "puppet" but not a crook.

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Gary Englert

4:57 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

@ Paul P: And your's would be more cowardly, anonymous nonsense.

Paul P

5:07 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

And your biased opinions have no merit.

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Gary Englert

9:20 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P: The opinion of, an indentifiable human being, whose resume and biases (if any) can be easily ascertained, has far more merit than those of someone clearly ill-informed who is hiding behind a psuedonym.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

5:39 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

What screen name Gary ? That is my name. Quit the name calling. It is beneath you.

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Gary Englert

6:02 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

@ Paul Corrigan from West Orange: Oh, are you and "Paul P" one in the same, or is this the latest take on the "Musical Screen Name Game?"

Paul P

6:02 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

John McKeon was a Mayor of a town that had a large swath of millionaires. His political backers and supporters, some of them are millionaires. His business associates and some of his personal friends, are millionaires. It's refreshing to see a politician stand up to a big bully like Christie, at the risk of alienating some of his millionaire friends.

LOL

Adam Kraemer

6:15 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

I do not quesiton the motive or the sencerity of John Mckeon. He is a "stand up guy" However, from the data I have seen in New Jersery. See the Boston University Study on what happend when taxes rate on the rich went up under Governor Corzines term in office and the date on tax increase recently in Great Britian. It show taxing the rich does not work well. So I do think he is engaring in ill- advised public and economic pollicy. Raising tax rate on the rich will most likely back-fire and will not generate revenue for the state. Unfortunately It will damge the tax base long term. The better quesiton to ask is does the staes and it's 21 counties, its 560 plus municipalites, its 600 plus school board, and the numerous other public authorities have to spend and the amount they are spending? We have to have goverment spend less and focus only on the govermental service that are really needed. Then we can have tax releif for all and a better economy

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Mikey

9:33 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

If you are referring to the BC study that Gov. Christie has referred to as taking $70M out of the state, here it is: www.bc.edu/content/dam/files/research_sites/cwp/pdf/njreport.pdf

Page 27 (table 7) shows the percentage of wealthy people who left New Jersey for 18 different reasons; taxes are not listed as one of those reasons. "New Job or Job Transfer" is the highest percentage for both millionaires and all households.

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Gary Englert

9:13 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Adam Kramer: If it comes down to taking your economic advice, or Warren Buffet's, I'm going with "The Oracle of Omaha."

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2012/02/billionaire_buffett_snaps_back.html

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Gary Englert

10:21 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

@ Paul Corrigan from West Orange: Then work on your reading comprehension since my comment (re: hiding behind a screen name) wasn't directed at you.

Paul P

6:21 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012

Adam is right. At the local level, small town expenditures are out of hand. One example, does everyone who works in a local town hall need an all expense paid Blackberry ?

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Gary Englert

9:18 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P: Just how have you concluded that "everyone who works at town hall" has a Blackberry?

At best, it's likely they're issued just to department directors and not even to all of them if the necessity to be out of the office isn't a regular part of their workday.

Democracy

6:38 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Millionaires do not leave the State because of a small income tax increase.

The number of millionaires in NJ actually increased while we had a millionaire's tax.

We now have a higher number of millionaires than any state in the country except California, even though we have less than 3% of the country's population.

People move to NJ for the schools and access to jobs. Paying another few thousand in income taxes isn't going to push someone who makes more than a million a year to live elsewhere.

Let's look at the data and stop basing our public policy on ideology.

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Adam Kraemer

6:59 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Democracy - Could you kindly site the source where you get your data: The data I have seen contracditcs what you are stipulating.

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Democracy

9:09 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

The number of millionaires by State for 2009, 2010 and 2011 can be found here:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/pf_article_113718.html

New Jersey's number of millionaire households is the second highest in the country and it went up between 2009 and 2010, when the millionaire surcharge was in place.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

6:56 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Any opinion on this board is right away met with attacks and name calling. It is disgusting. Tone it down!

MP

7:48 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Before raising anybody's taxes, we need to consolidate municipal govts and school boards to reduce expenses. People like McKeon want to take money from taxpayers and give to public worker unions because they are his supporters. Until that link is soundly broken, the taxpayers will suffer. Mayors can control school boards. They can turn down BOE budgets and ask them to redo. They rarely do because of union support.

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Gary Englert

9:40 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ MP: This is an old saw ("People like McKeon want to take money from taxpayers and give to public worker unions because they are his supporters.") that is just so much nonsense and at variance with documentable fact.

First, there are 30,000 registered voters in West Orange and 1,200 (500 municipal, 700 Bd of Ed) government/quasi-government employees; only about 50% of whom live and vote in the Township.

To believe that any politican panders to them to the exclusion of all others is nonsense and suggests the accusers inability to do basic math: if government employees are your only supporters, you're not winning elections.

Further, by that same logic, no self-interested politician would do anything to alienate this group and reduce this support, would he?

Please then explain why McKeon (and subsequently Parisi) have consistently reduced the size of the municipal workforce and privatized services whenever and wherever possible?

Tom G.

8:25 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

MP is right. As long as the taxpayers have to continue supporting excessively bloated salaries to municipal employees then we will continue to suffer. Paying over $200k to the superintendent, asst. superintendent, police and fire chiefs, and others is absolutely absurd. And that doesn't even include the lifetime pensions and benefits these people get. The fact that these people earn so much at the taxpayer's expense just goes to show how powerless we are. Doesn't anybody ever question this stuff? Consolidating municipal governments will never happen in our lifetimes because these municipal workers and unions are getting a great deal right now and would only stand to lose out with any kind of consolidation.

Gary Englert

9:08 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Mac:

A question for you: What do you think would be fair compensation for the COO of a private company with a $130,000,000 budget, 11 facilities and 700 employees serving 6,800 customers daily in a highly regulated environment?

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Paul Corrigan from West Orange

9:12 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Depends on who is paying the compensation-

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Gary Englert

9:46 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul Corrigan from West Orange:

Well, one either believes in and understands a free market economy or one does not.

Regardless of who is paying the bill, it's simply unrealistic to expect that an individual with the prerequsites to fill the aforementioned COO slot could be had for what is being paid the typical frye cook at McDonald's.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

9:15 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

How do you fix the problem? All new State workers just cannot have the benefits that the older ones had. State cannot afford it. We also cannot afford to pay the current pension system or teacher health care costs.

Exactly how much do public workers have to put in for their health care and pensions? What if they had to pay what the rest of us pay? Would that save money? Maybe we need to up the retirement age for state workers. Maybe we need to eliminate carry over of sick and vacation time like is done in the private sector. No more payouts for un-used vacation or sick time. Just ideas.

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Gary Englert

9:36 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul Corrigan from West Orange: You're right on all counts as there has been a paradigm shift when comparing public sector compensation/pensions and benefits to the private sector; the current system is not sustainable.

Still, we can't pillory people for having made a career choice 20 or more years ago and it is simply fundamentally unfair to pull the rug out from under them.

New employees? New rules...period.

Sick and vacation day payouts should be eliminated, banking and use of the former allowed but, surrendered on retirement.

Larger contributions to both benefit packages and retirement funding must also occur.

Tom G.

10:24 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@Gary - the amount of compensation that is considered "fair" is highly subjective. I found this article from 2010 (http://www.njspotlight.com/stories/10/0726/2116/) that states the average superintendent salary in NJ was $163k. The article goes on to say that this amount is at or near the top nationally. So that means the superintendent in WO is getting paid almost $100k more than the state average, and is one of the highest paid superintendents in the entire nation. Is the WO school district so large, complex, and unique that the superintendent should command one of the highest salaries in the nation at this position?

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Gary Englert

10:51 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Mac:

With +/- 600 school districts (of varying sizes) in the State, I am not at all surprised that the average salary is $163,000. You should also keep in mind that we are not one of the smaller systems and are located in one of the highest cost of living (COL)areas in our state.

That said, our Superintendent is nowhere near being "one of the highest paid superintendents in the entire nation," or even the New York metropolitan area, as the articles below will clearly illustrate.

What is amazing to me is just how large some of the salaries being paid are, given they are in areas where to COL is dramatically lower than ours.

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/Highest-Paid-School-Superintendents-New-York-School-Salaries-132960303.html

http://www.texastribune.org/library/data/texas-superintendent-contracts-annotated/

http://www.illinoisloop.org/salary.html

Paul P

10:28 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

"People like McKeon want to take money from taxpayers and give to public worker unions because they are his supporters.")

It's true. Politicians have to play a messy balancing act every day. Just watch how Mckeon complains about how unfair it is for the millionaires to get tax cuts, While he has to pander to the union groups who donate to his political campaign, keep his millionaire buddies happy, follow Codey's and the Democratic party line, and keep up the image of being a regular joe . Being sleazy isnt easy, but that's politics, sleazy.

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Gary Englert

10:54 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Paul P: No, it's not true and you clearly don't understand the nature of government and the legislative process if you can't acknowledge that compromise is an integral part of the process.

That said, look at some NJELEC reports and convince yourself just how small a part government employee union donations play in the broad scheme of things.

Paul P

10:57 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

What you call "compromise" is what I kissing ass. Politicians have to kiss the ass of the big money contributors to their war chests, the party they represent and the constituents. And McKeon is a politician, nothing more, nothing less.

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Gary Englert

11:46 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P: Well then, gven that the founding Fathers created a Constitutional democracy, comprised of a government containing three distinct parts and relying on the concept of majority rule, compromise (or "ass kissing" as you prefer) goes with the territory.

Precisely what system would you prefer there, Paulie?

Paul P

11:01 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Mac,If you knew of the waste that goes on in the board of education, the salaries they collect pale in comparison.

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Gary Englert

11:45 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P:

Why not enlighten us about the "waste that goes on in the board of education?"

I'm sure you have some great, fact based, verifiable information to impart upon the readers of this blog.

NOT!

Paul P

11:16 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

The founding fathers never envisioned a future where unions and political campaign contributors held the strings of the puppet politician.

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Gary Englert

11:40 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P: They also never envisioned radio and television, the result being a significant part of the population having their opinions reduced to, and no more profound than, parroting the nonsensical soundbites heard therein.

Pointing out problems (or your version of them) is easy; care to share some solutions?

Paul P

11:34 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

I'd like to hear other people in this forum share ideas and solutions, without you having to interrupt the flow of conversation every time , with demeaning, insulting and mr know it all responses.

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Gary Englert

11:39 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P:

So, you've got nothing, huh?

Why am I not surprised?

It's a public forum Paulie and anyone is free to jump in any time they'd like.

It's not a matter of my being "Mr. know it all," it's a matter of you not knowing anything at all.

Mary Mann

11:51 am on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Gary and Paul P,
Both of you, please tone it down. Stick to the topics and stop insulting each other. Gary, I really appreciate that you participate in these forums but you do tend to attack those who disagree with you in a hyperbolic manner with words like "ridiculous," "absurd," and "unbridled nonsense." Dial it back please!

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Gary Englert

12:24 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Mary Mann: My response s best given at sidebar and I've sent you an e-mail,

Nick Muson

12:12 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

"The founding fathers never envisioned a future where unions and political campaign contributors held the strings of the puppet politician"

The Founding Fathers never envisioned a system with political parties. The Founding Fathers never envisioned that women or blacks could vote. The Founding Fathers never envisioned that money would be part of any political campaigns. The Founding Fathers never envisioned an hourly wage. The Founding Fathers never envisioned incorporation. The Founding Fathers never imagined that our political system would be a system of competing interested parties. The Founding Fathers never imagined a civil war would occur less-than a century later. A lot of the Founding Fathers thought banks were a tool of oppression. The Founding Fathers distrusted "Papists" (that's Catholics to you and I) more than any other religious group.

By 1800, our democracy had already taken a turn towards party and self-interest that the Founding Fathers never imagined. What they DID imagine was that society needs to be able to adapt to changing circumstances.

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Gary Englert

12:32 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Nick Muson: Well said but, I also doubt any of them thought that labeling anyone (working within the established system) as a "crook, sleazy, shady or unethical," without basis in fact, would result in civil discourse, let alone accomplish much of anything.

Anonymous

12:26 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

The reason that your local property taxes are going through the roof is that the NJ Supreme court has diverted almost all of NJ's Taxpayer Relief Fund (aka the Income Tax) to 31 school districts, leaving the suburbs with huge income tax bills AND huge property tax bills.

What has Assm McKeon done to help . . . NOTHING.

Adding additional "millionaires" taxes just takes more money from the 'burbs and shifts it to the Abbotts. Without some guaranteed level of property tax relief to all municipalities and school districts, trying to fix all the world's ills with ever increasing income tax rates is a fool's errand.

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Gary Englert

12:42 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Anonymous:

Laying responsibility for the inequities of property taxes on one legislator is foolish and uncalled for as true reform will require a majority of the legislature to support it.

The problem is, and always has been, that there will be as many winners as losers if reform is instituted and thus we have paralysis.

I can assure you that Assemblyman McKeon would very much like to see such reform.

His colleagues down in Salem and Cumberland counties?

Not so much!

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Anonymous

1:07 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

You can "assure" me?? Are you an official spokesperson for the assemblyman? Can you point us to one piece of legislation he's introduced or sponsored that would truly lighten the tax burden for suburban taxpayers?

And of course there will be "winners and losers," as there have been for the past three decades as we've seen our Income Taxes go up and up, always with the promise that it will provide property tax relief, yet year after year the money has been shifted to the only group that ever wins, the Abbotts.

And it isn't just McKeon, but he's the one on TV pushing yet more income taxes to "fix" the property tax problem.

McKeon Freudian Slip about "Trickle Down" is correct. However, it's "Trickle Down" Property Tax Relief doesn't work.

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Democracy

1:23 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

That is absolutely WRONG!

First, we don't have Abbott anymore. As of 2008, our schools are funded via a formula that allocates resources based on the needs of the children and not on where they live.

School districts with children who are more expensive to educate because they are low-income, special needs or limited English proficient, are supposed to receive more funding under the formula. If a district doesn't have a tax base to draw on, the State has to provide more of that funding. You can pay to educate those children now or pay to keep them in prison later.

To say that all of the income tax goes to the 31 former Abbott districts is ludicrous and completely untrue. For example, South Orange-Maplewood is supposed to receive $7 million from the State and West Orange is supposed to receive $9 million. I say supposed to because Governor Christie has underfunded those districts for the last two years and has proposed doing so again this year.

If his budgets funded the schools rather than giving $1.2 billion in tax breaks to corporations, less of the burden would fall on local property taxes. If the 10% income tax goes into effect, it will come directly from school funding and you can guarantee that either your property taxes and fees will rise or the quality of your schools will go down, lowering your property values.

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Gary Englert

3:09 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Anonymous:

Yes, I can "assure you" that Assemblyman McKeon would very much like to see property tax and education funding reform.

I know the man well, and his feelings in this regard, and while I am not his "official spokesman," I am one of his Legislative Aides.

It's pointless to introduce legislation for the sake of introducing legislation, or simply being able to point to having done so, if it has no chance of being passed into law.

A great deal is played out behind the scenes and gaining consensus and the support of the majority required to make that happen. With the makeup of the legislature changing every two years, it's often a "two steps forward, one step back" situation.

Look what happened with gay marriage; two years ago, the legislation couldn't make it out of either the assembly or the senate.

This month, the bill made it to the Governor's Office, only to be vetoed.

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Time4Dick2Go

12:46 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

If you won't even propose legislation, how do you expect to make any changes? People need to be rallied around something tangible, not just the throw-away line, "I can "assure you" that Assemblyman McKeon would very much like to see property tax and education funding reform."

It's time to get serious, or get out of the way. Taking up a seat in the legislature and voting as the party and the unions direct is in conflict with the needs of your constituents, and there's nothing moral about that.

Paul Corrigan from West Orange

12:42 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Gary, I am not saying you bone people 20 years in. That, is just plain not fair. Howver, people under 10 years in, should be adjusted and new people should be set up in a whole new way. New workers shoud pay for their health care and retirement the way the private sector does with no mandated protection written into law. That goes for the unions as well. I think we would eventually find more money in the system where we could pay our teachers/cops/firefighters more money down the road.

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Gary Englert

12:56 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul Corrigan from West Orange:

We are substantially in agreement on most everything, with the possible exception of health benefits for public safety personnel.

As putting one's life and limb at considerably more risk than the typical wage earner goes with the territory, I'd be more inclined to see them bear less of the burden of the cost of their coverage than non-uniform types.

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Anonymous

1:11 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Heath Care insurance for Public Sector employees has been growing at 15 - 20% per year for the past decade. With taxpayers picking up 100% of the cost, employees have had zero incentive for looking at more economical plans, or to try to find ways to utilize health care providers in a way that would save their employers any money.

Until employees pay a reasonable share (20 - 35%), costs will continue to grow at rates that will cripple local, county and state governments' ability to deliver needed services as they cut programs and staff to cover the benefits for remaining employees.

Paul P

1:21 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

The top 5 contributors in 2009 to Mckeons campaign funds

New Jersey Bankers Association
Heavy & General Construction Laborers Local 472
Naiop New Jersey Chapter
New Jersey Education Association
New Jersey Business & Industry Association

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Gary Englert

1:45 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P: And if that be true, it appears to be an eclectic mix of organizations with often competing interested who will get exactly what anyone who hasn't made a donation to Assemblyman McKeon will get: a fair and impartial hearing of their concerns and appropriate action when and if it is in the public good.

You can't legislate ethics and morality and a man with both isn't about to be swayed by a campaign donation.

Mary Mann

1:57 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

Also, let's refrain from calling people "sleazy" or "corrupt" — without corroborating evidence. If you have facts about the Assemblyman's conduct that you want to share and debate, please do so.

Paul P

2:02 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

So you're saying this "eclectic" mix of "organizations" donate large sums of money and gain nothing , they simply donate money and receive impartiality? That was the short list of contributors, here's a longer one. Looks like many unions donate lots of money to receive impartiality.

NEW JERSEY BANKERS ASSOCIATION
HEAVY & GENERAL CONSTRUCTION LABORERS LOCAL 472
NAIOP NEW JERSEY CHAPTER
NEW JERSEY BUSINESS & INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION
NEW JERSEY EDUCATION ASSOCIATION
NEW JERSEY COALITION OF AUTOMOTIVE RETAILERS
VALERO ENERGY
PLUMBERS & PIPEFITTERS LOCAL 9
STEAMFITTERS PIPEFITTERS & APPRENTICES LOCAL 475
NEW JERSEY APARTMENT ASSOCIATION
EW JERSEY ASSOCIATION OF REALTORS
MEDCO HEALTH SOLUTIONS
NEW JERSEY FOOD COUNCIL
COMMUNICATIONS WORKERS NEW JERSEY
FUEL MERCHANTS ASSOCIATION OF NEW JERSEY
INTERNATIONAL COUNCIL OF SHOPPING CENTERS
NATIONAL AUTO DEALERS EXCHANGE
NEW JERSEY AMERICAN SOCIETY OF LANDSCAPE ARCHITECTS $850.00
PLUMBERS LOCAL 24
FUEL MERCHANTS ASSOCIATION OF NEW JERSEY
HARTZ MOUNTAIN INDUSTRIES

SUNOCO INC CORPORATE POLITICAL CONSTRIBUTIONS $500.00

NEW YORK SHIPPING ASSOCIATION
OPERATING ENGINEERS LOCAL 68

UTILITY & TRANSPORTATION CONTRACTORS ASSOCIATION

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Gary Englert

2:26 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P:

Yup, that's exactly what I'm saying.

It may have escaped your notice but, we are all better served with intelligent, principled people in public office and Assemblyman McKeon has the support of many who believe just that.

Most on this list appear to be trade organizations, not unions and certainly not public employee unions.

MP

2:15 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

You cannot compare a school superintendent with a COO of a private company with similar budgets. BOE gets the money by picking the pockets of the taxpayers and gives a big salary to the super. A COO has to worry about where the money is going to come from every day so that he can pay the workers. They can go bust if the company fails. But the BOE will continue to pick the pockets at will. That is a big difference.

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Gary Englert

2:30 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ MP: While the profit motive is clearly missing, one can certainly compare a public and private entity in terms of size and complexity.

I stand firm in my resolve that, in most cases, you'd be hard pressed to find someone running a private company the size of the West Orange Public Schools who was not being paid substantially more than $225,000 per year.

Paul P

3:14 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

I have to laugh at intelligent and principled,. Do you have proof of their integrity and or intelligence? And the list included unions, many of them, and the so called trade groups are just called special interest groups. Spin it as you like, I proved my point.

Gary Englert

3:38 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P:

Laugh all you wish but, I've known Assemblyman McKeon, and his family, for more than 20 years (and some of his family for far longer than that) and have found him to both intelligent and principled.

What you've "proven" is simply that the man receives support from a broad spectrum of organizations...period.

He also receives support from a widely diverse group of individuals, as well.

You automatically assume that equates with his ethics and objectivity having been compromised and I know, first hand, that is simply not the case.

Don't assume that because your allegiance can be bought that others are like minded.

Paul P

3:48 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Legislative Aid to John McKeon - Gary , 17 of the 22 on that list are unions and special interest groups pertaining to real estate development. Hardly a "broad and diverse" group. And that's the short list, I haven't even listed individuals, who again are mostly in real estate funding and development. I proved my point, again.

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Gary Englert

5:12 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P:

And where is the lack of "Integrity" in representing and assisting a municipality in the legislative district you represent?

None that I see.

While I would dispute how you characterize the organizations you previously listed, what is the point you think you've proven?

If it is that the man has compromised his ethic by accepting a donation from anyone, you've submitted nothing in evidence to support such a claim.

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Time4Dick2Go

12:41 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

Why was Codey's hometown the only one getting a million bucks? Weren't there enough ornaments on the Christmas tree for everyone in the 27th District?

Paul P

4:08 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Legislative Aid to John McKeon Gary - During an election year , Candidates Codey, Jasey & Mckeon award 1 million dollars to Roseland. Yeah, your right big deal. They they each receive an award from Roseland, big deal, And they happen to mention they are all running for re election, yeah, no big deal. My favorite part of the video is when Codey busts McKeons chops about why Codey moved from West Orange to Roseland, because McKeon " coulnd't keep the taxes down"

Hilarious stuff

Paul P

4:18 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

I have to apologize, I made an error. That video was from 2009, when McKeon was still a West Orange mayor. My bad.

Gary Englert

4:22 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P: It was 2009...and nobody was running for re-election at the time...and big whoop, Governor Codey has a sense of humor!

What substantive does any of this have to do with anything?

It surely doesn't have a damned thing to do with anyone's ethics being compromised.

Paul P

4:28 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

I agree, not ethics were compromised, a local mayor who was also is a state legislator, is at a ceremony to award a town 1 million dollars. recieve an award , and just happen to mention they are running for re election. Like I said no big deal. And Codey was half joking, but only half. If you spoke to his neighbors and life long friends in WO, it was the same story, Dick got fed up WO's high taxes.

Gary Englert

5:11 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012

@ Paul P:

Right, Dick got fed up with the "high taxes" which is why he still owns his home on Beverly Road.

The man was joking and let's assume I know him far better, and for far longer, than you, shall we?

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Alex Sohn

1:54 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

"His" home? The one he sold in January 2010? The one he still pays the property taxes on? The new owners must be so grateful!

Or is there another "home" on Beverly Road that Richie owns?

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Gary Englert

2:47 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ Alex Sohn: The salient point of the exercise was that Governor Codey did not move to Roseland because he was "fed up" with the "high taxes" in West Orange; he purchased a home there some time ago, did extensive renovations to it and ultimately moved in.

He continued to own the home he owned and lived in (on Beverly Road) for some time thereafter and I recall he was renting it.

If he sold it, it's news to me but, I'm not quite as obsessed with other people's private business as some.

I do know that buying, renovating and re-selling homes is not something foreign to the Governor who owned at least one other (on Beverly Road) in addition to the own he and his family occupied.

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Alex Sohn

6:40 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

The salient point is that you spew whatever nonsense enters your head. You claim to be close to people who move and leave you no forwarding address. :-)

Pathetic.

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Gary Englert

6:45 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ Alan Sohn:

Hardly, Governor Codey moved to Roseland, I had/have his new address and was aware he retained ownership of his former residence on Beverly Road and was renting the property.

He had no need to tell me he subsequently sold it and I had no need to ask and if any of this is germane to anything of substance, I fail to see where.

wohopeful

2:59 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

Dick Codey stated in public that he fled West Orange because of the high taxes. And he is no longer a resident of West Orange.

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Gary Englert

3:25 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ wohopeful:

Anyone not understanding that Governor Codey has a sense of humor, and that he was teasing John McKeon when he made these remarks, simply fails to acknowledge that the two men are long-time friends and colleagues.

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Time4Dick2Go

12:40 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

An alternate explanation, and a much more plausible one is - Sometimes the real truth just slips out. In politics, it's what's known as a Kinsley gaffe.

wohopeful

3:44 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

One would think that someone who has held public office for most of his professional career would understand the line between "humor/teasing" and being serious, especially in front of a room full public citizens and in front of cameras. But with that said, he is still on record as having stated to the public that he fled West Orange because of the high taxes.

I cannot imagine what the "humor" must be like when the cameras are not rolling and Mr. Codey does not have a public audience, I'm sure we would see a whole other side to Mr. Codey.

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Gary Englert

4:07 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ wohopeful: Taken in context, the remarks were entirely appropriate,,,and humorous...despite any subsequent editorializing and spin.

If the worst you can say about someone is that you didn't appreciate an intentionally humorous remark they made three years ago, I'd say they don't have too much to worry about.

wohopeful

4:15 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

I don't believe Mr. Codey has ever come out and stated his comments about fleeing the high taxes in West Orange, were meant to be humorous or even good natuered teasing. In fact watching the video it would seem he was being serious so no need to editorialize or spin anything.

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Gary Englert

4:48 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ wohopeful: I don't believe Governor Codey needs to come out and state that his clearly humorous comment was a clearlyhumorous comment, meant to be good natured teasing, nor has anyone (publicly or privately) ask that he do so.

The editorializing and spin are all yours, wohopeful, as anyone viewing an unedited version of the clip can certainly make their own evaluation of its meaning and intent without your help.

Michael

4:31 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

My buddy Gary talks out of his a** once again. All you need to do is look at your tax bill to know how stupid he sounds defending Mckeon. please Mr Mckeon get the hell out, we can't afford you protecting us from evil republicans. Stupid morons want to chase the few wealthy that are left in West Orange out, that makes sense . God... libs really are stupid. They always get caught too, its so funny to watch them fall 1 by 1, Keogh, Mckeon... same thing.

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Time4Dick2Go

5:44 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

Gary - Is your full time, taxpayer funded job to sit on Patch and rebut every remark made about the useless District 27 representatives?

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Gary Englert

6:23 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ Michael: I rather doubt you're "my buddy" as my friends aren't of the type to hide behind screen names spewing venomous nonsense.

Neither John McKeon, nor any other single individual (Republican of Democrat), is directly and solely responsible for whatever pain you're feeling as a result of your local property tax bill and to suggest such a thing is nonsense.

"Libs are stupid?"

Well, it appears that Warren Buffet is among them since his ideas on taxes and economic policy pretty much mirror John McKeon's.

I don't know about you, Mikey but, I'd love to be as stupid (and rich) as Warren Buffet for just an hour!

Mentioning Kevin Keogh and John McKeon in the same breath is to say you know neither of them very well at all, as more polar opposites never existed.

Do politicians stumble and fall?

Sure...and so do people in every other profession and vocation walking the face of the earth...and such folly isn't the sole province of one political party over another.

Please do keep in mind that only one President and one Vice-President of the United States (in the last 50 years) resigned their respective offices ahead of the filing of criminal charges and/or probable impeachment and both were conservative Republicans.

Gary Englert

5:56 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ Time4Dick2Go: A battle of wits with people who take the field unarmed is hardly work and far too much fun to be paid to do it but, thanks for asking!

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Time4Dick2Go

12:34 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

Ah, so droll, yet you didn't answer the question.

And your lame defense of a bunch of limousine liberals who vacuum up hundreds of millions in taxes, yet return a fraction in tax relief (whoop-di-freakin-do, they got a whole $1M for Dick Codey's hometown of Roseland) is just pathetic.

Everyone knows they are the protectors of the status quo when it comes to tax reform, tenure reform, or any other type of reform that would really benefit THEIR constituents.

Paul P

6:12 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

Please do not mention Kevin K and Johnny Mack in the same sentence, unless you include the other 2 miscreants , R Trinklet and Murray P

Paul P

6:13 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ Alex Sohn the point was and is, Codey moved to Roseland, toe escape the high taxes, sure he may be renting the Beverly home, but now Gary admits Codey had enough money to buy a home in Roseland, renovate it, and move in, with all the money he saved by leaving West Orange.

Gary Englert

6:21 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ Paul P:

Is this about the best of what you've got or will you actually ever say anything intelligent?

wohopeful

7:35 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

Dick Codey is on record as having said he fled West Orange because of the out of control taxes. There is no dispute about it as it is a matter of public record.

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Gary Englert

8:00 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

@ wohopeful: Well then, I guess you'll believe whatever you'd like and it's all inconsequential anyway.

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wohopeful

9:01 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

Thank you Mr. Englert as I knew I had it correct. Any doubts we could just go to the video archives.

Too bad about cousin Ray though huh?

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Gary Englert

11:28 pm on Wednesday, February 29, 2012

wohopeful: No, you don't have it right but, it's all inconsequential, as I said.

There's a scene in "The Godfather" where Hyman Roth is discussing his protege Moe Green's death with Michael Corleone (who had him killed), where Roth, after telling Michael that though Moe was a visonary whom he loved like a son, he had his flaws and didn't complain when he was killed because, "Michael, this is the business that we've chosen."

That phrase is one of my personal mantras.

Well, Ray Codey took a job in the political arena and shifting sands are a part of it that I'm sure he understood,

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Time4Dick2Go

12:37 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

Freud would have a field day with someone who admits he lives his life based on a quote from a fictional organized crime boss.

Maybe you shoulda went with, "leave the gun, take the cannolis."

Paul P

12:39 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

Roseland got $1,000,000 dollars, and all West Orange got was a stupid calendar, with pictures of Roseland.

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Time4Dick2Go

12:48 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

Don't worry, McKeon, Jasey and Codey are down in Trenton fighting every day for the hard working taxpayers in District 27, and in a few minutes GaryE will put up another post telling us that.

Democracy

4:40 am on Thursday, March 1, 2012

Codey Jasey and McKeon were all easily re-elected last November, so district voters obviously like them. If you think their politics are too progressive, perhaps you should move to a more conservative district in NJ or even move out of State?

Nothing is served by the kinds of personal attacks that have dominated this comments section except to turn off other readers. It certainly doesn't change any minds, especially the partisan name calling.

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